Clinton Camp Says 2026 Number No Longer Relevant For Nomination
Clinton delegate master Harold Ickes says now that the Obama campaign has declared its willingness to seat delegations from Michigan and Florida at the Party Convention in August, the number of delegates once thought to be required to win the nomination is no longer operable.
“There’s an unwritten assumption that 2026 is the number to get the nomination. That could not at this point be further from the truth,” Ickes told reporters on a conference call. “Obama seems to have crossed the Rubicon, and is in favor of some resolution of Michigan and Florida. Until they are fully resolved, there is no fixed number for the nomination.”
“2210 is the high mark,” he said — referring to the number of delegates needed if the Michigan and Florida delegations are seated fully — “and it appears 2026 is the low mark. But that low mark is no longer in my view a reasonable number to even talk about.”
The DNC’s Rules and Bylaws Committee meets on May 31st to decide what to do about the two states. But Communications Director Howard Wolfson acknowledged that even if the Clinton campaign gets everything it wants from the committee, her path to the nomination still relies on convincing uncommitted superdelegates that she’s the stronger general election candidate.
“Senator Clinton is ahead in the popular vote. Senator Clinton has won the key swing states a Democrat has to win, she’s ahead in the key swing states in polling,” he said — pointing to new Quinnipiac polls showing her beating John McCain in Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania while Obama wins only Pennsylvania and by a lesser margin. “She runs better against John McCain than Senator Obama in rural areas, and all of this adds up to the stronger candidate. And that’s a case we’re going to have to make.”
Wolfson also called Obama’s initial steps to being the Vice Presidential search “premature in the sense there’s no nominee yet,” and said he was unaware of any similar effort in the Clinton campaign.
Check out my notes on the rest of the conference call below.
-DNC vet Ickes says the campaign has been talking with the cochairs of the rules and bylaws cmte of the DNC that will decide whether and how to seat the delegates from MI and FL, but said he wouldn’t talk about the nature of those discussions. Called for all delegates from the states to be seated with a full vote, and for the “uncommitted” delegates from MI (where Obama was not on the ballot) to be seated as uncommitted, not as Obama delegates. “All delegates should be seated and all delegates should have a full vote each. With respect to Michigan, it is our view that the uncommitted delegates, of which there are 55, should be seated as uncommitted delegates.”
-asked later whether that was a change in position, Wolfson and Ickes stipulated that most uncommitted delegates would likely vote for Obama, as is their right — but Ickes said “It is however presumptuous to assume that each and every one of those delegates is an Obama supporters… It may well be for Senator Obama, but it should not be for the the campaigns or the rules and bylaws committee to force delegates to be in a category or supporting a candidate ,including uncommitted unless of their own free will.
-Wolfson brought up the new Quinnipiac polls in OH, FL and PA that show HRC beating McCain in all three while Obama wins only PA — and wins there by a smaller margin than HRC. “11:42:21 look at the map, Senator Clinton has the winning map against Senator McCain. We would win the states that John Kerry won in 2004. we would add AR and West Virginia and Florida and Ohio. And we would certainly be competitive in states like NM and NV, and Iowa that Senator kerry lost. if you look at Obama, he is hanging on narrowly in Pennsylvania, our margin of victory is umuch greater in Pennsylvania, and he’s losing Florida and Ohio.,” he said. “It becomes very difficult to get to 270. He is losing NH. He is losing West Virginia. So the combination of states one would need that doesn’t include Florida and Ohio becomes very very difficult.” Wolfson said that’s the case they’re making to superdelegates.
-Wolfson was careful not to suggest that Obama COULDN’T win, just that HRC had a better chance. “11:43:53 not to say that if Senator Obama is the nominee he couldn’t win these states. Not that he wouldn’t be our next president. But who’s won these states, won them in primarym, would be the strongest possible nominee against John McCain. “
- he also said Obama appeared to have written off WV. “11:41:52 An AP article said Senator Obama’s team has written West Virginia off. I remember the days of the 50 sate strategy. That strategy may not include West Virginia or Florida or Michigan, depending on their positiotn on seating them,” he said.
-said he had no reaction to the Obama VP search. “11:55:36 it is clearly premature in the sense that he is not the nominee. But far be it from us to tell him when to begin a process. He presumably could have begun the process last year for all we know.” denied there were any similar processes underway in the clinton camp. Also denied that there were any discussions underway with the Obama camp about HRC joining an Obama/Clinton ticket.
-Ickes defended voting for punishing FL and MI by pulling all their delegates while he’s now in favor of seating all of them by saying the DNC wanted to send a message to other states wanting to move up, and that that message was received. He also claimed the states have been punished even if their delegations are now seated, since they were deprived of the money and prestige that comes with candidates campaigning in the states, arguing that the party must now look ahead to the general election and decide what’s best if they want to win the WH.
-Wolfson wouldn’t clarify HRC’s statement to the AP that she might take things to the convention if MI and FL aren’t seated to her satisfaction, saying “we’ll have to wait and see what happens.” said Clinton would look to the voters and leaders of MI and FL after the rules cmte makes a decision and take her cues from them. Of a possible appeal to the credentials cmte at the convention, Ickes said “it is our expectation that the rules and bylaws committee will decide based on full vote. We’re not prepared to cross bridges we may not have to cross.”
-Wolfson says even the Obama campaign now agrees that the “status quo” must change and is in favor of seating MI and FL delegates in some fashion. “both sides have taken the position that the status quo was untenable, not tenable to ignore the votes and the states, he said. “so what we’re arguing about is ignore them halfways or fully honor them. But lets be clear, the rubicon has been crossed by the Obama campaign. They now believe the status quo is untenable
-Ickes followed up to say that that fact means the number 2026 is no longer operable. “There is an unwritten assumption in the fourth estate that 2026 is the number to get the nomination. That could not at this point be further from the truth. Obama seems to have crossed the rubicon, is in favor of some resolution of Michigan and Florida. Until they are fully resolved, there is no fixed number for the nomination,” he said. “2210 is the high mark , and it appears 2026 is the low mark. But that low mark is no longer in my view a reasonable number to even talk about.”
-Wolfson says one reason HRC didn’t speak out about the importance of voting rights in FL and MI until it actually mattered to her electoral hopes was bc no one expected people to come out for the penalized primary. , there was every expectation that these votes would not be consequential in terms of turnout, because of the DNC rules. And I think what we saw surprised everyone… we have a harder case to make if 5000 people came out.”
-he also outlined the path to the nomination - which is difficult since even if they get everythign they want out of FL and MI they’ll still trail by 60 delegates or so. It basically involves making the case to superdelegates that she’d be the best president and the best candidate against john mccain by looking at polling and primary results in swing states and districts. “Senator Clinton is ahead in the popular vote. Senator Clinton has won the key swing states a Democratic has to win, she’s ahead in the key swing states in polling. Shre runs better against John McCain than Senator Obama in rural areas, and all of this adds up to the stronger candidate.”
“We run stronger in swing districts. We run stronger in swing states. And swing districts and swing states elect presidents,” he said.
Tags: barack obama, convention, dnc, Florida, hillary clinton, john mccain, Michigan
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FACTS: no one is talking about.
Clinton was the only top-tier candidate on the MI ballot despite the fact that the DNC had ruled—and all of the candidates agreed to it—that all candidates must remove their names from the ballot.
No campaigning was permitted in either state. Camp Clinton was the only campaign that could be argued as not following this rule. They setup highly visible offices. One was actually across the street from a strip club.
Clinton wants all of the delegates to count from FL and MI, despite the fact that the states broke the rules. Even the GOP took away half of the delegates from FL and MI for breaking the rules.
A similar situation occured in 1996 with the state of Delaware, but no one made it an issue. Delaware was stripped of all delegates, but it did not seem to have a major impact on the final numbers of delegates in the primaries.
Obama showed honesty, naivete, lack of savvy—take your pick—by not hedging his bets like Clinton. Clinton gambled that the issue would be resolved prior to the actual primary dates, but too late to enter a name onto the ballot.
Excellent Blog…Read blog # 148 By Tony Smith…if you want to know why lots of Americans will never vote for Barack Obama
http://www.reclusiveleftist.com/?p=913
Hillary Clinton the peoples choice
oh good grief…. as a clinton supporter even I know it’s over…. I can understand the desire to allow ALL the states to be able to vote and voice their opinions (this IS the correct way to proceed) but geeeez, at some point it’s time to let it go… Hillary, you have proven that you are a very viable and strong candidate for the presidency but the numbers are not with you… your campaign staffers blew it for you with a lot of blunders….
it’s time to rally support for Mc Cain….the lesser of 3 evils!
It’s political suicide to not count these votes and not count them fully.
See I see a pattern here. Hillary has a hard time with numbers. She has now hasd lost 30 million in her won campaign and now doesnt beleive that 2026 is the number. How could she ever run this country.
This is just the beginning of Hillary’s fight to get this nomination. Your article is a vivid reminder that Hillary is NOT going to go quietly and that she will rally to change whatever rules best improve her chances. We must remember that Hillary feels entitled to the presidency and this is what she has aspired to. She will let nothing get in her way of the prize and will “obliterate” (with the same fervor she would punish Iran if it attacked Israel) anything that blocks her path to the White House. Along the way if she destroys the foundation of her party, so be it. No amount of financial hardship, pending lawsuit (Peter Paul case), abandonment by party loyals, or lack of super delegate endorsements will slow her push to enter the final phase of this contest with John McCain. There are no rules to stop her, no “magic number” to acquire–in fact it is an open contest for Hillary. It just demonstrates how she sees the world and how she has ALWAYS railed against the institutions of an organized society. It is going to get UGLY from here on out!
I use to have a lot more respect for Hillary.
But out of despairation she is making many errors. She wants to continue down this pattern of changing the rules when they are not in her favor.
Is this the kind of leadership we are to expect from her.
She began this campaign as the inevitable candidate, Big mistake!!!
She needs to shown more maturity and integrity. If she continues down this path, she will frustrate the election to where her party wll look foolish. Due to the Bush failures, the Democrats have a ral chance at a win. Hillary is risking her party’s potential win for her own agenda. And this is exactly what the republicans want.
If Hillary steals this nomination you can be sure the support she has from Fox news and the conservatives will disappear.
Hillary Clinton is making a spectacle of this primary election and herself. It is becoming very difficult to watch someone this desperate. She is beginning to sound like a spoiled child and her quest for power is getting old.
teo,
There is no fair way to seat ALL of the delegates. Even the GOP took away half of each state’s delegates for moving the primary dates to January, as punishment for not following rules agreed upon by both parties.
Clinton: Ran a bad primary campaign, run by poor strategists, and budget analysts, but with evolving themes that connected to regional Democrats.
Obama: Ran a good primary campaign, run by good strategists and budget analysts, but with a recurring theme that shows little resemblance to actual legislation.
McCain: Ran a bad pre-campaign, recognized it, recalibrated it into a good primary campaign, run by good strategists and budgeters. His themes are clearly stated, but remain a little inconsistent in areas that poll as most important to American voters.
It’s almost half-time in the campaigns. The 2nd half starts after the conventions.
I am a Hillary supporter too, But I can see the writing on the wall. I now think, if she takes this to the convention, its going to be horrible to our party.
Wasn’t it Ickes who said the rules are the rules??????????????????? There has to be some sort of penalty here, unless Ickesssssss doesn’t think the other 48 states are important to the process.
There is no way that the votes should be cast for one candidate. The votes for Edwards in FL should go to Obama since he endorsed Obama, and the 40+% from MI should go to Obama. That is only fair because Ickesssssss does not know how they would have voted if Obama’s name had been on the MI ballot, and to assume that those who voted for H. Clinton did so because they wanted her to win when they could have been voting against McCain is also false thinking.
To say that she has the popular vote is also false. I can’t figure out what map he is using. I have looked at the voting percentages and have followed this campaign closely, and there is definitely manipulation going on here. I can’t vote for Obama because I am pro-life, but I would vote fo him over H. Clinton anyday. I just can’t handle the way she has conducted her campaign. With the 3 Clintons campaigning aginst 1 Obama and started out with a well-known name against an unknown - they shouldn’t be in this situation at all - not even close!!!!! That tells me a lot right there.
Please Super delegates, stop this. Why are you sitting back and letting Clinton do this to the party? Please super del’s, stop this crazy woman.
Clinton is without a doubt, the most polarizing democrat in the last 15 years.
Poor Hillary, she’s being treated sooo badly. I suggest we just nab the Primary from Obama and give it Clinton. After all she is entitled!!! RIGH??? GIVE ME A BREAK!!!
Out of over 300 million Americans, why do we keep voting for the same families? Has things really gotten better?? Are we really that stoo-pid as Americans that we continue to choose name recognition over much needed change? I think not!! Let’s give a new family a try; it has to be better than the last two families occupying the white house. The Clintons brought us scandal and the Bushes brought worldwide hate for Americans.
CHANGE WE CAN SEE OBAMA 08
Some of you people are dreaming that Obama is going to be the nom!! Its totally impossible at this point!! He is so un-electible that the DNC would just be giving up all hopes of a Dem being in the White house. It is just the truth!!!!
I am a white working class male in Illinois and Obama has not helped me or my family out once since he took office I will NOT vote for him and I have talked to all my family members cousins and all and they will Not vote for him so that about 100 votes for Mcain from Illinois and WE WILL NOT CHANGE OUR MINDS and unite behind Obama
It’s not over, Gore won the popular vote and we were coaxed into Bush. Clinton will win the popular vote and will win decisively over McCain. After Obama’s Rev. Wright, his wifes comments and all his associations, he won’t win in november. If he is the nominee, myself and everyone I know will vote McCain. We don’t need a racist as president.
I believe (I read this on one of the news media) on the Delaware debackle the votes were eventually counted… Pelosi was in charge of the DNC and SHE ruled in favor of counting all the votes. The precedent has already been made - they should count the votes they should also allow ALL states to be able to cast their votes accordingly… If California did not push their primarly up to super Tuesday date we would have had our primaries this June… I would want my vote to count! I absolutely HATE the media for misleading and slated reporting and spinning negativity into this election process…. I blame them 80% for the error in selecting our presidency… 20% for the stupidity of the public to take their information at face value and follow blindly….
BEFORE I decided to support Clinton (I of course already knew of the scandals and the not so honest factor) I researched all of her past votes in the senate, the committees she worked on, her speech on the Iraq war vote and most importantly her solutions to our country’s plight… she was and still is the ONLY candidate that had detailed information on how she would solve our issues… this IS the reason why I supported her- not because of some sort of feminity, or because he’s black and she’s white nor the issues of her piggy husbands action… and I would still vote for her as she is the only one who has stepped up and demonstrated her resilience and her intelligence her ability to be in the forefront on solving our economy and the oil delemma- her intestinal fortitude to take on the oil cartel… I just heard on the news congress was going to investigate and go after the cartel… Hillary said it first and look at the idiots now following the lead… on the oil tax rebate - Obama voted for it a while back and now he states he isn’t for it… why- because he takes OIL money from OIL executives $$$$ …
so now, I have no choice to either write in Hillary’s name on my independant ballot or to cast my vote for Mc Cain…. and again this IS my choice and it is my right to be able to vote however I choose… and my choice is based on facts not race, not gender….
Hilary is stupid. I’m so tired of her pulling the party down. I hope she will be graceful and step down. It’s time to move on.
THE INMATES ARE NOW RUNNING THE CLINTON ASYLUM
Comment by Patty,NJ
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:14 pm
Some of you people are dreaming that Obama is going to be the nom!! Its totally impossible at this point!! He is so un-electible that the DNC would just be giving up all hopes of a Dem being in the White house. It is just the truth!!!!
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The truth in your opinion. You are probably one of the undeducated Hill/Billy supporters who do not know how to use an adding machine. Give me a valid formula by which you think Hill/Billy can win without stealing it. Just an additional note. The convention will not overturn Barack’s nomination.
The total number of delegates to win the nomination were reduced when the party stripped Fl and Mi…it only makes common sense if the DNC now allows these delegates to be seated the original # of delegates to win would also be increased…
Who cares this is the ” New Democratic Party” listen to your Leaders…Donna Barazil she stated that very clearly….I say take it to the Convention and let the chips fall where they may…The democratic party as we once knew it..is NO more…that is a reality…
Hillary’s supporters put America and Americans rights over party loyalties…
IN October there will be a tape released about Michelle Obama talking down to white people and using the term whitey among other things so if that comes to light Obama will lose.If the DNC wants the white house they better think about the Obamas closet
There is no taking it to the Convention. He will reach the number before then, and the DNC will not overturn it.
Wasn’t it Al Gore who said: “Every vote must count?” The voters should not be punished because the DNC made a bad decision. Someone needs to remind Mr. Obama there are 50 States in this country, not the 47 he claimed. There are 47 Islamic States! As a resident of Michigan I think there should have been a re-vote. Yet Obama would not agree. We will not forget!
If Obama is the DNC choice, McCain is going to be spotted a 20% lead because of his race.
If Clinton is the DNC choice, McCain is going to be spotted a 20% lead because she’s a Clinton.
Since McCain is the presumptive GOP choice, he is going to be spotted a 20% deficit because his wife is refusing to reveal her tax returns.
If John wants the White House, Cindy’s going to have to release her tax returns. That is what is politically correct in 2008 and is also what John is shaping his campaign around, transparency in politics.
If Hillary steal’s this things somehow, count me as a McCain supporter. Much of the moral fiber of U.S. citizens is to play by the rules, and it is frustrating to see people when things don’t go their way to try an change those rules.
National polling is showing Obama up by 10 points (Zogby & Gallup) on McCain and growing so if Hillary want to discuss that fine. She loses the arguement.
The one issue in this campaign is can John McCain convince the American people he is not George Bush III. If he can do this he will win, if cannot he will lose..
That is the one and only issue, because at a 32% approval rating George Bush it is like an anchor around McCain’s neck.
I guess I am just tired of the monarchy of Bushes and Clintons this country has had for the last 20 years, I thought we the Revolutionary war was about getting away from being ruled by King’s & Queen’s.
I will be happy if either Obama or McCain (as long as he is not a Bush clone) wins and Hillary does not.
Neither Hilalry or Nobama have the needed delegates to win the nomination..they both need the superDs to be ‘Selected” as the nominee..so its the Party Hacks that will decide this nomination..and if they “Select” Nobama we know why …they are afraid of Riots…this has been the threat for the last 2 months…and nothing has changed except Hillary will win the Popular Vote once all primaries are finished…She is the People’ Choice…so there is no stealing of the nomination…
Remember, jusst a few, if you will:
Hillarycare
Whitewater
Turned $1000. cattle futred to $100000 in 10 months of trading
Peter Paul
Midlife Partners
Vincent Foster
Bosnia Sniper Fire
Hillary has every right to follow the primary process to the conclusion. If not the Democratic party democratic process would be a JOKE. As it stands now who cares about the votes of the every day people. We are not smart enough to elect, thats why we have the SUPER
Ickes and Wolfson keep doing everything you can to divide the democratic party. You all agreed in the beginning that the delegates would determine the person who gets the nomination. Now that is not good enough. The fact is because the republicans have screwed things up for the last 8 years, Obama or Clinton would win the Presidency. But constantly putting down Obama by making your point that Hillary is the better candidate just hurts the party. I just hope Obama does not take advice from either of you two and Terry.
It is sad that this race is turning out to be about RACE. It would seem that even this blog is about race seeing that my last post was not posted
Hillary is destroying her own party because of her RACE and those of her RACE who do not want a BLACK MAN to become the next President of the United States of America.
God, can this woman fight or what! i would have hated to have gotten a divorce from her.
she would have cleaned my whislte and still have hunted me down after the divorce.
there is no way she’ll want the # 2 position and i don’t tink obama would want to have to tangle with her for 4 years. it might be the worst thing for this country if it happened.
i just wish i knew hillary would fight for america as hard as she’s fighting obama.
either way, i know mccain will go to his grave fighting for america. it almost happened once before.
American Woman,
The Obama campaign will fight seating all of the delegates. Period. The DNC will fight seating all of the delegates because the states must be punished. Even the GOP punished both FL and MI by taking away half of their delegates.
I think the final solution for the DNC will a formula to seat only half of the delegates, which is exactly what the GOP did. By seating half, each party will have disenfranchised the voters equally.
Here’s where it gets interesting. If the DNC seats only half to reflect what the GOP did, then the GOP can turn around and seat all of the delegates and not affect the outcome of their primaries because the GOP uses winner take all, and not a proportional system.
Oh. Fox news site. I should have known better.
rev henry,
this nomination may be about race to some, but not me.
i’m not voting for obama because i dont agree with his policies, and more importantly, his associations.
but, i gotta say he had me about 6-7 mos ago. then the kool aid wore off.
Hillary has the right to fight to the end! She just needs to realize that she lost and she can’t keep moving the goal post.
Comment by Beverly, Houston
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:27 pm
Comment by Patty,NJ
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:14 pm
Some of you people are dreaming that Obama is going to be the nom!! Its totally impossible at this point!! He is so un-electible that the DNC would just be giving up all hopes of a Dem being in the White house. It is just the truth!!!!
___________________________________________________________________________________
The truth in your opinion. You are probably one of the undeducated Hill/Billy supporters who do not know how to use an adding machine. Give me a valid formula by which you think Hill/Billy can win without stealing it. Just an additional note. The convention will not overturn Barack’s nomination.
================================================================
This is a good enough reason for me!!!
http://larrysinclair0926.wordpress.com/2008/05/21/obama-sd-vince-powers-blames-clinton-supporters-for-exposing-obama-drug-sex/#comments
BEV….ADD THAT!!!!
Democrarts against democrats, there has never been anything like this before. How did this happen? Obama supporters turned on the Clintons, the Clintons gave us eight great years, and this is how they thanked them. Obama and his supporters have brought some ugly baggage into this party.
Good grief!! The unmitigated gall of this woman. What? Does she think she’s owed the darn thing? Did you note the finish of this year’s Kentucky Derby - how Hillary’s pick (EIGHT BELLES) finished second to BIG BROWN, and then promptly had to be put down. Perhaps a strange parallel at work here?
woo hoo, it will be 2210!!!! add that Obamabots!!!!
Hampton…its all about the skin color to the same skin color…Nobody in their right mind would vote for someone like Obama!!!
Rev Henry,
Hillary Clinton is continuing her campaign because of promises to voters throughtout the campaign that she would continue. She continues because quitting would mean a politically fatal broken promise. She made the promise because of who she is.
Has anyone noticed that Obama jumped out to roughly a 130-150 lead in elected delegates after Super Tuesday, Feb 5……and that the lead has remained relatively fixed ever since?
Hillary still has got in her head with her millions she buy the superdlegates over to side. America watch out for she has something planned and she will get it her way. What a shame America has such canidate running for president.
Rudy NYC
If the DNC had RNC rules..Hillary would already be the nominee…and not just “Selected” With all the DNC rules and proportional representation of the different states and cacacses…this is one Big Mess..and the RNC..at least had some winner take all..Both party rules..sound undemocratic to me…How do you decide which state is take all and which is not…?
Patty,
I see you and others on here several times bringing up this lame BS. The man has been exposed as a fake, having failed 2 Lie Detector tests.
Please stop with the stupid Paid Clinton Supporter tricks.
PAT - ADD THAT, SUM IT UP, COUNT ON YOUR FINGERS AND TOES IF YOU KNOW HOW.
RULES ARE RULES!!! Both candidates knew that the elections in Michigan and Florida would not count. Hillary thought that this would be over afer Super Tuesday, as she was so far ahead in the polls. She didn’t care if the results in Florida or Michigan would be counted as she stored up her super delegates(She had a 97 Superdelegate lead going into Super Tuesday, That lead has been cut to 20 recently) She has no chance to catch Obama in the delegate race!!!Having lost the national elected delegate race, Hillary Clinton now wants to count the popular vote and seat the delegates from Michigan and Florida in her campaign’s efforts to change the rules of the nomination race. It’s a fraudulent argument as the Michigan primary ballot did not offer Democrats real candidate choices.
Here is what actually happened. The four top tier Democratic candidates — Obama, Edwards, Richardson and Clinton — all pledged to the Democratic National Committee (DNC) they would not campaign in Michigan, and Florida after the DNC ruled that Michigan’s and Florida’s delegates would not be seated at the national convention because Michigan changed its primary date from February 26 to January 15.
Obama, Edwards and Richardson kept their pledge and removed their names from the ballot. At the last minute, Clinton left her name on the ballot, with the full knowledge that the results would not count. Obama, Edwards and Richardson complied with the rules, while Clinton did not keep her pledge.
Although there was no other viable candidate’s name on the primary ballot, only 55 percent voted for Clinton. Instead –
45 percent of Democratic voters cast their ballots as “not-Clinton” - 40% who voted the “Uncommitted” line and 5% who voted for one of the remaining candidates that were not viable.
An additional 27,694 voters did not have their votes counted, most of these likely due to “write-in” votes — anyone writing in Obama, Edwards or Richardson’s name had their ballot ruled invalid and discarded.
“Uncommitted” won more votes than Clinton did in major cities such as Grand Rapids, Detroit, Flint, Saginaw and Ann Arbor. The “not Clinton” vote also won in Wayne (the state’s most populous county), along with several other counties. If write-in votes had been counted, the results would likely have tipped against Clinton in several more cities and counties.
Democratic turnout in Michigan was lower than every other state primary except Utah — a state that gave Bush 70 percent of its vote in 2004.
Recent analysis of the 2008 turnout in other states compared to Michigan’s turnout — indicates that more than 700,000 Michigan Democratic voters, who could have been expected to participate, stayed home rather than vote. They didn’t participate because they understood there was no real Democratic election choice in Michigan.
Michigan primary history had previously established a precedent for the 2008 situation. During the contested presidential primary of 1980, the DNC ruled that Michigan delegates would not be seated at the convention because the state was holding an open primary not recognized at that time by party rules. President Jimmy Carter and his challenger, Senator Edward Kennedy both kept their names off the ballot — they honored the rules.
Clinton did not follow the precedent set by Carter and Kennedy. Instead, the Clinton campaign tried to claim Michigan delegates that were not earned competitively. When that gambit failed, Clinton began counting the popular vote in Michigan as part of her national total.
The facts associated with the Michigan Democratic primary make it clear that Michigan voters were disenfranchised by the election. As a result, the primary vote cannot be considered an honest and valid measurement of the support for any Democratic candidate in Michigan.
Perhaps a fitting postscript can be found in a recent Michigan poll by Lansing-based EPIC-MRA. In that highly respected poll, Obama led McCain 43-41 percent, while McCain led Clinton 46-37 percent. Obama was running a full 11 percentage points better than Clinton in Michigan — when matched against McCain.
If Michigan had not moved up its original primary date of February 26, a vigorous and fair democratic primary election campaign in Michigan could have taken place. Then the real voice of Michigan Democratic voters would have been heard. Anll the current evidence indicates that the voters’ choice would have been Barack Obama — not Hillary Clinton.
yes, Hillary and all of her bitter, sour-grapes, women-scorned supporters are indeed all acting like spoiled brats…..wanting to change the very rules she herself signed and agreed to now that she’s obviously lost. All their “I’m gonna vote for McCain” threats show exactly how stupid they are. It’s pitiful and pathetic.
Comment by Patty,NJ
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:46 pm
woo hoo, it will be 2210!!!! add that Obamabots!!!!
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Nice to see the real Patty NJ with us this aftenoon…
Wrong, Rudy. They were never told to or encouraged to remove their names from ANY ballot. The rules said they couldn’t campaign in those states, but COULD fund-raise. Obama removed his name from Michigan ONLY to avoid an early loss. This is known. Obama also ran “national ads” in Florida, which no other candidate did. HRC would be the strongest nominee and is the ONLY candidate who has shown respect to ALL voters from the beginning. Get your facts straight before going off on a rant, please.
To Patty,NJ
You need to get a life and stop drinking in the afternoon.
this is a response to Gene that said Obama didn’t help him yet.
What kind of help do you need?
Senators vote for big bills in Washington. You should concentrate on your alderman, mayor and governor in your state. They are the ones that are suppose to help people in each individual state.
Comment by American Woman
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:51 pm
Comment by Patty,NJ
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:46 pm
woo hoo, it will be 2210!!!! add that Obamabots!!!!
________________
Nice to see the real Patty NJ with us this aftenoon…
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Les me go thru this again. Read up on the rules committee. What they will do is divide the 2 states in half. So HILL/BILLY CLINTON BOTS (FOR LACK OF A STRONGER WORD), we are back to the same. She still trails by almost 170 delegates.
Comment by Don, NY
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:52 pm
Wrong, Rudy. They were never told to or encouraged to remove their names from ANY ballot. The rules said they couldn’t campaign in those states, but COULD fund-raise. Obama removed his name from Michigan ONLY to avoid an early loss. This is known. Obama also ran “national ads” in Florida, which no other candidate did. HRC would be the strongest nominee and is the ONLY candidate who has shown respect to ALL voters from the beginning. Get your facts straight before going off on a rant, please.
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Stop making stuff up. Obama and the rest of the candidates removed their names so an not to upset Iowans as they were supposed to be first. This is what every candidate said. He didn’t remove his name to avoid a loss. That is just plain stupid. He knew he would lose WV and KY yet he didn’t remove his name.
Comment by coloradoansforobama
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:54 pm
To Patty,NJ
You need to get a life and stop drinking in the afternoon.
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Woo-hoo, no wonder she cannot add.
Comment by Rev Henry
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:34 pm
It is sad that this race is turning out to be about RACE. It would seem that even this blog is about race seeing that my last post was not posted
Hillary is destroying her own party because of her RACE and those of her RACE who do not want a BLACK MAN to become the next President of the United States of America.
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Read blog # 148 By Tony Smith…”Black Man for Hillary”
reclusiveleftist.com/?p=913
The Clintons are political veterans, there is nothing they wouldn’t do to achieve their goals.
I am not sure how you can count the votes in a state where 1 of the candidates was not on the ballot.
Also not allowing candidates to campaign in those states was an enormous advantage for her. The name Clinton was well known.
The only person Hillary cares about is Hillary.. And she will try to manipulate the rules so they will favor her.
http://www.reclusiveleftist.com/?p=913
i still think the best ticket is obama/hillary.a vp that no one knows would start the mess for voters all over again confusing them more.then if mccain brings in someone like romney,everyone knows him,and it would be a close race,unless it is obama/clinton which might be a landslide.it really seems to be who obama wants to listen to,the voters,or his black constituency.
John Edwards and Barack Obama..both had surogates in MI with an campaign against Hillary Clinton to vote uncommited…this was a plan from the start …why do you think Nobama blocked a re-vote…?
it’s a free country.
ron paul can keep his candidacy smouldering along. barr can join in the fray. why should hillary throw in the towel? free country last time i checkd and there is no law that she’s breaking.
Well, I guess when Karl Rove hands over the tape of michelle Obama ranting her mouth off about “WHITEY” at The trinity of H*ll then lets hear what you will be crying then!!! Just like Obama…never can stop cryin!!
Comment by client #8
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:00 pm
it’s a free country.
ron paul can keep his candidacy smouldering along. barr can join in the fray. why should hillary throw in the towel? free country last time i checkd and there is no law that she’s breaking.
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You are right that she can stay in if she wants because this is a free country. But you also need to know that I have the right to demand that she get out of the race for the same reason, it is a free country with freedom of speech.
So that being said, I demand that Hillary get out of the race and go home and never show your face again.
OBAMA SUPPORTERS - DO YOU THINK 16% OF THE NATIONS POPULATION IS GOING TO WIN IN NOVEMBER?? IS THAT REALLY WHAT YOU THINK.. HONESTLY?? YOU THINK THE RED STATES ARE GOING TO LINE UP BEHIND OBAMA IN NOVEMBER. MOST OF THOSE STATES HAVENT VOTED DEMOCRATE IN 30 PLUS YEARS AND YOU REALLY THINK THAT IS GOING TO CHANG?? LETS BE HONEST HERE!! THE LARGEST PORTIONS OF THE WHITE VOTE ALWAYS VOTE REPUBLICAN. THIS IS NOT GOING TO CHANGE. YES OBAMA CAN GET 92% OF THE BLACK VOTE AND STILL LOSE IN NOVEMBER BY A LANDSLIDE. HE IS ONLY GETTING A FRACTION OF THE WHITE VOTE. HARDLY ANY OF THE ELDERLY WHICH ALWAYS VOTE. ARE THE YOUNG ADULTS GOING TO BE THERE IN NOVEMBER AFTER THE HYPE OF THE PRIMARIES IS OVER?? PROBABLY NOT!! SOME WILL OF COURSE BUT IT IS SPECULATED BY PAST ELECTIONS THAT THIS GROUP WILL LOSE INTEREST BY NOVEMBER. THERE GOES WHAT LITTLE WHITE VOTE OBAMA WAS GETTING!! WHEN YOU PIT ONE RACE AGAINST ANOTHER IN ANY ELECTION,, IT IS A SAFE BET TO GO WITH THE ONE WITH THE MOST NUMBERS..THATS ONLY COMMON SENSE!! BOTH CANDIDATES SUPPORTERS HAVE MADE THIS HAPPEN NOT JUST ONE!! THE BLACK VOTERS LINED UP BEHIND OBAMA AND THE WHITE VOTERS BEHIND HILLARY AND MCCAIN.
WE AS HILLARY SUPPORTERS WILL NOT LINE UP BEHIND OBAMA!! EVER!! IF THE DNC OFFIALS CANT SEE THIS THEN THEY ARE JUST BLIND. !! HILLARY IS NOT THE ONE HURTING THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. OBAMA IS 50% THE BLAME AS WELL . AT ANYTIME TIME HE COULD HAVE DROPPED OUT AS WELL AND HE CHOSE TO STAY IN. IF IT IS THE PARTY YOU ARE WORRIED ABOUT THEN YOU SHOULDNT HAVE SPLIT IT DOWN RACIAL LINES.. THE OBAMA SUPPORTERS SET THE STAGE AND THE EXAMPLES ,, WE ARE JUST FOLLOWING THEIR LEAD!! THIS IS NOT MEANT TO BE RACIAL IN ANY WAY!! ITS JUST THE WAY THINGS ARE AT THIS POINT AND TIME.!!
If Obama was as smart as you think..why was he so stupid to not have his name on the ballot to begin with. I will tell you…he thought that he would try to get away with not counting them because he didnt have his name on the ballot. Hillary knew better. as usual. You Obamabots are going to fall really hard and its is ashame!!!
Is she trying to break some rules?
alright jim go ahead and demand. and
i demand that you never show your face again, but then that would be stupid, wouldn’t it?
yeah right Jim…She will listen to you!!! KA-BA-HA!!!!
13 more days and then reality will sink in for Hillary!!
Comment by client #8
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:05 pm
alright jim go ahead and demand. and
i demand that you never show your face again, but then that would be stupid, wouldn’t it?
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It is your right to say what you please because this is America. And it is my right to ignore what you say as I am do now.
Comment by Patty,NJ
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:06 pm
yeah right Jim…She will listen to you!!! KA-BA-HA!!!!
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No she’ll never list to me because she is a crazy banshee!!
Comment by albert
May 22nd, 2008 at 3:58 pm
i still think the best ticket is obama/hillary.a vp that no one knows would start the mess for voters all over again confusing them more.then if mccain brings in someone like romney,everyone knows him,and it would be a close race,unless it is obama/clinton which might be a landslide.it really seems to be who obama wants to listen to,the voters,or his black constituency
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NO WAY IN HELL